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Tight ends....why have them

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  • Tight ends....why have them

    Last gripe. Why do we even recruit tight ends? Just go get more linemen.....if you can find them.
    we certainly dont use tight ends in the passing system....

  • #2
    I agree completely, Bill. I remember when ND used to have those huge TE's. They'd toss a little pass over the middle and those big guys would run for what seemed like forever.
    Philippians 4:11 & 4:13

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    • #3
      Rigg caught one pass and the interception was thrown to him. Two of seven attempts were to the TE.

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      • #4
        Originally posted by fastkat View Post
        Rigg caught one pass and the interception was thrown to him. Two of seven attempts were to the TE.
        The never-be-happy-fellowship-of-the-miserable-"UK football fan" doesn't care about facts.

        Given the injury situation with our team, I'm amazed at the job our staff has done. I we were 1 yard from winning. We lost.
        Jordan Peterson is my spirit animal...

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        • #5
          Originally posted by Spiritof96 View Post

          The never-be-happy-fellowship-of-the-miserable-"UK football fan" doesn't care about facts.

          Given the injury situation with our team, I'm amazed at the job our staff has done. I we were 1 yard from winning. We lost.
          The always-find-the-silver-lining-sunshing-pumping "UK football fan" is just as annoying.

          One could also say that even with our injury situation, we were considerably better than Tennessee, and conservative play calling and ridiculous decisions killed all momentum and cost us the game. As bad as Tennessee has been in the past decade and as far as we like to think we've improved, we've only won once.

          Mark Stoops is a fine evaluator of talent, but he remains a mediocre head coach.

          To the OP, I'm not going to argue about the tight end situation this year because of our injury problems and all the stuff that comes with them, but CJ Conrad was shamefully underutilized last season, and for that there was no excuse. That kid was an All-SEC level talent and a matchup nightmare, and for some reason our coaching staff refused to use him effectively.
          Last edited by KCKUKFan; 11-10-2019, 01:02 PM.

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          • #6
            Originally posted by Spiritof96 View Post

            The never-be-happy-fellowship-of-the-miserable-"UK football fan" doesn't care about facts.

            Given the injury situation with our team, I'm amazed at the job our staff has done. I we were 1 yard from winning. We lost.
            The facts in this particular case is that Tennessee has been decimated this year on their lines, has almost no running game and was using a former starter that had been benched for concussion, bone chip in hand and ineffectiveness in Garantono. The fact also is that Kentucky ran straight into what strength Tennessee did have on four plays instead of a toss. Also is the fact that Kentucky multiple times eschewed field goal attempts...and lost by one field goal and one point.
            the facts also are Stoops said Sawyer could play but stayed with Bowden so the wr at qb excuse is a choice. The fact is also that CMS seems to adore using zone in our secondary with 4 men rushing and leave our most inexperienced players against Tennessees most experienced players in their recievers.
            it may be complicated, but it isn't Rocket science.
            two years in a row, Kentucky is the better team and loses.
            so yes, this is a miserable result to this particular game.
            Last edited by 40bill; 11-10-2019, 01:18 PM.

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Spiritof96 View Post

              The never-be-happy-fellowship-of-the-miserable-"UK football fan" doesn't care about facts.

              Given the injury situation with our team, I'm amazed at the job our staff has done. I we were 1 yard from winning. We lost.
              As a 50+ year fan and watcher of most of the games we have played, don’t tell me about miserable. I have watched UK try almost everything to win in the SEC. I have seen just about every kind of coach from Ray to Stoops. I have heard the excuses, rationalizations and blaming for UK’s losing football culture. At 60 I have resigned myself to the fact that I will not live to see UK play for an SEC championship. The current UK team is a microcosm of UK football, if only, potential, woulda ,coulda ,shoulda.. since the advent of the internet the fan base is more visible and vocal but it’s attitude remains basically unchanged. One camp cheers and makes excuses when we come up short and tell those of that don’t like it to shut up, be reasonable, face facts, be real. The other camp watches the endless circle of mediocrity and untapped potential and asks for something better. In the last 20 years Rich Brooks made modest gains at UK, Joker ran the program in the ground. Stoops has made modest gains, he has upgraded the talent level considerably, what he hasn’t done is demonstrate any acumen in on field coaching,his offenses are bland and uninspiring, in game adjustments non existent. He is overly conservative and cautious and often plays not to lose insuring his teams do just that in big game,He consistently lose to middle of pack SEC teams ei.Miss State, UT. I could go on but I will not, for I have already seen this movie several times already. UK is a mediocrity in football and at least in my life time will remain so, for those of you content to beat 3-4=non conference tomato cans, Vandy and one or two other SEC teams who are also having bad season then Stoops is your man. For those who want more, I guess you will have to keep telling us to shut up
              Last edited by Jload; 11-10-2019, 05:28 PM.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by 40bill View Post

                The facts in this particular case is that Tennessee has been decimated this year on their lines, has almost no running game and was using a former starter that had been benched for concussion, bone chip in hand and ineffectiveness in Garantono. The fact also is that Kentucky ran straight into what strength Tennessee did have on four plays instead of a toss. Also is the fact that Kentucky multiple times eschewed field goal attempts...and lost by one field goal and one point.
                the facts also are Stoops said Sawyer could play but stayed with Bowden so the wr at qb excuse is a choice. The fact is also that CMS seems to adore using zone in our secondary with 4 men rushing and leave our most inexperienced players against Tennessees most experienced players in their recievers.
                it may be complicated, but it isn't Rocket science.
                two years in a row, Kentucky is the better team and loses.
                so yes, this is a miserable result to this particular game.
                And here I thought we were talking about tight ends.
                Jordan Peterson is my spirit animal...

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by KCKUKFan View Post

                  The always-find-the-silver-lining-sunshing-pumping "UK football fan" is just as annoying.

                  One could also say that even with our injury situation, we were considerably better than Tennessee, and conservative play calling and ridiculous decisions killed all momentum and cost us the game. As bad as Tennessee has been in the past decade and as far as we like to think we've improved, we've only won once.

                  Mark Stoops is a fine evaluator of talent, but he remains a mediocre head coach.

                  To the OP, I'm not going to argue about the tight end situation this year because of our injury problems and all the stuff that comes with them, but CJ Conrad was shamefully underutilized last season, and for that there was no excuse. That kid was an All-SEC level talent and a matchup nightmare, and for some reason our coaching staff refused to use him effectively.
                  And yet no one made an excuse or spoke of a silver lining.

                  We win 10 games and how CJ was used was a part of that. The point is to win. While we were winning and after we won we have “fans” ragging about using him as a blocker rather than pass catcher.

                  Mizzou is throws it around and makes great use of the te in the passing game and I hear they are looking for more fans, so...
                  Jordan Peterson is my spirit animal...

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Jload View Post

                    As a 50+ year fan and watcher of most of the games we have played, don’t tell me about miserable. I have watched UK try almost everything to win in the SEC. I have seen just about every kind of coach from Ray to Stoops. I have heard the excuses, rationalizations and blaming for UK’s losing football culture. At 60 I have resigned myself to the fact that I will not live to see UK play for an SEC championship. The current UK team is a microcosm of UK football, if only, potential, woulda ,coulda ,shoulda.. since the advent of the internet the fan base is more visible and vocal but it’s attitude remains basically unchanged. One camp cheers and makes excuses when we come up short and tell those of that don’t like it to shut up, be reasonable, face facts, be real. The other camp watches the endless circle of mediocrity and untapped potential and asks for something better. In the last 20 years Rich Brooks made modest gains at UK, Joker ran the program in the ground. Stoops has made modest gains, he has upgraded the talent level considerably, what he hasn’t done is demonstrate any acumen in on field coaching,his offenses are bland and uninspiring, in game adjustments non existent. He is overly conservative and cautious and often plays not to lose insuring his teams do just that in big game,He consistently lose to middle of pack SEC teams ei.Miss State, UT. I could go on but I will not, for I have already seen this movie several times already. UK is a mediocrity in football and at least in my life time will remain so, for those of you content to beat 3-4=non conference tomato cans, Vandy and one or two other SEC teams who are also having bad season then Stoops is your man. For those who want more, I guess you will have to keep telling us to shut up
                    Ok. I know this isn't about tight ends but rather about frustration .......

                    Well said JLoad. I go back to Charlie Bradshaw; he was the coach when I was frosh at UK and we know how things ended for CB. UK hired John Ray from Notre Dame and he was going to be great. After all, he came from ND. We know how things worked out for JR. Rinse and repeat. ......

                    I, like you, don't think I'll live long enough (just turned 71) to see UK play for an SECE title let alone the SEC title. However, I hear that next year and the year after will be great.

                    GBB. Beat Vandy.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by KCKUKFan View Post

                      The always-find-the-silver-lining-sunshing-pumping "UK football fan" is just as annoying.

                      One could also say that even with our injury situation, we were considerably better than Tennessee, and conservative play calling and ridiculous decisions killed all momentum and cost us the game. As bad as Tennessee has been in the past decade and as far as we like to think we've improved, we've only won once.

                      Mark Stoops is a fine evaluator of talent, but he remains a mediocre head coach.

                      To the OP, I'm not going to argue about the tight end situation this year because of our injury problems and all the stuff that comes with them, but CJ Conrad was shamefully underutilized last season, and for that there was no excuse. That kid was an All-SEC level talent and a matchup nightmare, and for some reason our coaching staff refused to use him effectively.
                      With the benefit of hindsight that the staff didn't have, what alternative playcalling would you have engaged in?

                      Would you have had Bowden throw the ball more? He's a remarkable athlete, but is not a very good passer. His throw to Rigg, who had no one between him and the end zone, was made with terrible technique, and thus instead of getting to the TE floated into into the defender's hands.

                      Would you have used different sets? Gran threw several different looks at them, and much of them worked, despite how limited the offensive personnel are right now.

                      What do you consider to be the ridiculous decisions?

                      I wasn't happy with the result either, but the team is without a healthy, SEC-caliber QB. What they've managed to do given that immense deficiency is pretty remarkable. They've just about maximized what's available.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by 40bill View Post

                        The facts in this particular case is that Tennessee has been decimated this year on their lines, has almost no running game and was using a former starter that had been benched for concussion, bone chip in hand and ineffectiveness in Garantono. The fact also is that Kentucky ran straight into what strength Tennessee did have on four plays instead of a toss. Also is the fact that Kentucky multiple times eschewed field goal attempts...and lost by one field goal and one point.
                        the facts also are Stoops said Sawyer could play but stayed with Bowden so the wr at qb excuse is a choice. The fact is also that CMS seems to adore using zone in our secondary with 4 men rushing and leave our most inexperienced players against Tennessees most experienced players in their recievers.
                        it may be complicated, but it isn't Rocket science.
                        two years in a row, Kentucky is the better team and loses.
                        so yes, this is a miserable result to this particular game.
                        The defense doesn't deserve criticism for this game.

                        Tennessee's first downs against their last 5 SEC opponents:

                        13 vs. Kentucky
                        14 vs. Mississippi State
                        18 vs. Alabama
                        20 vs. South Carolina
                        20 vs. Georgia

                        Tennessee's passing vs. last 5 SEC opponents:

                        10-14 for 167 yards vs. Mississippi State
                        14-25 for 213 yards vs. Kentucky
                        18-24 for 233 yards vs. Alabama
                        15-33 for 273 yards vs. Georgia
                        18-30 for 351 yards vs. South Carolina

                        Tennessee's rushing yardage vs. last 5 SEC opponents:

                        70 vs. Georgia
                        83 vs. Kentucky
                        114 vs. Alabama
                        121 vs. Mississippi State
                        134 vs. South Carolina

                        Tennessee's total yardage vs. last 5 SEC opponents:

                        231 vs. Alabama
                        296 vs. Kentucky
                        343 vs. Georgia
                        357 vs. Mississippi State
                        485 vs. South Carolina

                        Tennessee's scoring vs. last 5 SEC opponents:

                        13 vs. Alabama
                        14 vs. Georgia
                        17 vs. Kentucky
                        20 vs. Mississippi State
                        41 vs. South Carolina

                        Kentucky's defense did that in a game in which its offense managed two scoring drives, one of which covered all of 24 yards in 2 plays and maybe one minute of game time.

                        There was only one time when a FG could've possibly been a credible choice. These are how UK's drives ended:

                        1: touchdown
                        2: touchdown
                        3: punt from UK 36
                        4: interception thrown (Bowden to Rigg) from UT 37
                        5: punt from UT 40
                        6: punt from UK 18
                        7: sack on 4th and 6 at UT 32
                        8: incomplete pass on 4th and 3 at UT 38
                        9: no gain on 4th and goal at UT 2

                        There's one point in the game where attempting a FG could make sense. Down 17-13 in the 4th quarter, he could've sent out a very inconsistent freshman, who had already had an extra point kick blocked, to attempt a 49 yard field goal. What are the odds Poore makes that kick? If he makes it, the score is 17-16, and you have to trust that Kentucky then kicks to Tennessee but manages to outscore them the rest of the way. If he misses it, you're down 17-13, the same score as if you go for it on 4th and don't get it. I don't fault that call. If Austin MacGinnis was still on the team, you kick it, but there's no Austin MacGinnis on that team or most teams.

                        I guess you could've trotted Poore out there to attempt a 57 yarder before that. Good luck. McGinnis couldn't hit those. He'd already had an xp blocked; a block on that play could easily change the halftime score from 13-3 to 13-10. Missing a FG attempt leaves UT in position to try a few hail marys before the half; they connected on one at halftime last year and it was a killer. Instead they sent in Duffy and put them at their 25 and UT wasn't in position to put points on the board before the half. I don't fault that decision.

                        We don't have any indication that Sawyer Smith is healthy enough to play at SEC caliber. Stoops saying he could play doesn't mean he's at or near 100% or even 75% or 60%, or would've been effective in that game. Stoops saying Smith couldn't play, or wasn't close to full strength, gives Tennessee a huge advantage in preparing. Of course he's going to indicate Smith can play, whether or not Smith could play well or adequately.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          On a different note...What we're seeing with Kentucky this year - an entire season greatly altered because the starting QB went down to injury, and there's no backup QB nearly as good - is going to hit more and more programs, and bigger name programs, with a lot more frequency. The liberalized transfer rules and procedures, more and more, are resulting in backup QBs that are capable of leading a team to transfer to go play for a different school where they can start. We may start seeing it at other positions, but I don't think it'll be as pronounced at any offensive or defensive position the way it is for QBs. We may well start to see kickers become just as mercenary. The Alabamas of the world often don't offer scholarships to kickers and punters. Schools lower down the ladder do. Pretty soon we may see kickers and punters leave high school on scholarship for mid-level P5 schools and others, build up to being good starters after three years on that school's dime, then take off as grad transfers to play two years for Alabama or whoever.

                          If the rules change to allow players to profit off their likenesses, etc., you'll likely see more of the same. Some diamond in the rough who starts to shine at a place like Tulsa, Marshall, Utah State or wherever is going to be much more tempted to transfer to Texas, UCLA, Florida or wherever he can obtain a lot more exposure and money. Same may be true of kids playing at Kansas, Iowa State, Oregon State, Wake Forest, Maryland, Indiana, or Kentucky, too.

                          The rules - not the game, the rules outside the game - are changing, and a lot of those changes are going to benefit the haves, at the expense of the have nots.

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                          • #14
                            Both quarterbacks went down with injury.
                            I feel sorry for people who don't drink. When they wake up in the morning, that's as good as they're gonna feel all day. Frank Sinatra

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                            • #15
                              Kentucky's defense also did that because it wasn't on the field due to the TOP dominance by UK. The field.goal which would have been at 49 yards would have changed the complexion of the game by score and gained momentum. Tennessee's yardage....which was enough...was against a four man rush with no pressure. So Sawyer Smith is.not able to play? Stools comments were he was but going with th hot hand. Perhaps not.

                              But to your point on the defense....it was fine largely to the TOP control by the offense. Where the offense continually falls short is inability to convert in short yardage conditions.

                              This is not a case where Tennessee was a better team. Not this season.

                              Comment

                               

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                              With the recent discussion of rules and what is and is not posted I set out to find what our mission statement originally was and this is what I found:...

                              Tight ends....why have them

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