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  • #31
    We were big man U, and then something definite changed. The switch turned to OFF

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    • #32
      Someone said it best, come to Kentucky and battle for minutes or go to Oregon and play 30 minutes guaranteed as long as you stay out of foul trouble,it's a no brainer. Oregon is a big time NIKE elite school which means fringe benefits are just as good as ours and the pitch KENTUCKY ISN'T FOR EVERYONE just doesn't cut it no more......

      Regardless, we are fine, have faith in Nick and and think the transfer will be surprise a whole lot of folks this year, we still good....
      I can spell, blame it on my not so smart smart phone, makes up it's own words as it goes.....

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      • #33
        Nick Richards got in the way this year, I would imagine.

        It's ironic that we want to keep players but if Richards were to have left, I would say we have no problem getting one (or both) of Blackshear or Dante. (Not sure about Wiseman; that was a tough deal because of Penny.)

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        • #34
          Originally posted by Will Lavender View Post
          Nick Richards got in the way this year, I would imagine.

          It's ironic that we want to keep players but if Richards were to have left, I would say we have no problem getting one (or both) of Blackshear or Dante. (Not sure about Wiseman; that was a tough deal because of Penny.)
          I really don't know the answer or solution to this problem. How comfortable would a player feel about stepping into a program and taking away minutes from a guy who's worked hard and been there a few years? Everybody knows it business at the end of the day but if you are always going to recruit over someone else, then it makes sense why a player would rather go elsewhere and get 30 minutes to benefit himself over the team as opposed to playing for a school and having to scrap for 15 to 20 if you are lucky.................
          I can spell, blame it on my not so smart smart phone, makes up it's own words as it goes.....

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          • #35
            Originally posted by Will Lavender View Post
            Nick Richards got in the way this year, I would imagine.

            It's ironic that we want to keep players but if Richards were to have left, I would say we have no problem getting one (or both) of Blackshear or Dante. (Not sure about Wiseman; that was a tough deal because of Penny.)
            It's an impossible situation for a program because if they were to "Push" Nick out, whether it was a transfer or whatever and then still struck out with Blackshear and/or Dante then you are in even more peril. We all complain about kids not staying and then we wonder who we wouldve got if he wouldve left. Sure, I would trade Blackshear for Nick right now, just because Blackshear has proven himself, but Dante could be great and he may not.

            Penny really screwed us up and if he does well with this group you might as well throw him in the same conversation as Coach K and Self for future recruiting battles. Cal was the young swagger coach still when we got him, and now that is Penny. Time will tell how much he can coach, but we need him to not succeed or the recruiting is not going to get any easier in the future.

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            • #36
              I will always say I don't want a kid that isn't willing to battle to earn a spot. If you don't have that mentality that you are going to work hard and are just going somewhere because you know you are easily one of the five best players on the team and will get PT then go for it. It's been proven year in and year out that minutes aren't what get you drafted. If you can't showcase your skills in 25-25 min, an extra ten isn't going to help.

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              • #37
                Basketball is business and the top players want to be the number one focus as well as compensated in my opinion, why do you think some just go overseas for a year and skip college all together? Not saying that all players are getting paid but maybe Cal has stayed away from the players and the camps around them that want benefits?Jay Z Drake even Lebron James and team Nike isn't hanging around the Kentucky program or Cal now a days. No doubt in my mind that other schools have found a loophole to compensate a player like Wiseman, Zion, and many others in my opinion. On the outside it may seem like Cal is losing but he's running a clean program probation free, we are doing okay imo...
                Last edited by J.Jennings; 08-15-2019, 08:52 AM.
                I can spell, blame it on my not so smart smart phone, makes up it's own words as it goes.....

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                • #38
                  I would much rather have a clean program with our success, than have the so called "elite" players with the possibility of them or those around them being dirty, and win a tainted NC.
                  John 3:3

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                  • #39
                    Originally posted by Lighthouse View Post
                    I would much rather have a clean program with our success, than have the so called "elite" players with the possibility of them or those around them being dirty, and win a tainted NC.
                    Same here...
                    I can spell, blame it on my not so smart smart phone, makes up it's own words as it goes.....

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by Lighthouse View Post
                      I would much rather have a clean program with our success, than have the so called "elite" players with the possibility of them or those around them being dirty, and win a tainted NC.
                      100% agree.

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by Lighthouse View Post
                        I would much rather have a clean program with our success, than have the so called "elite" players with the possibility of them or those around them being dirty, and win a tainted NC.
                        I would too but I'm not sure this is what's going on with Kentucky, where we're missing out on these top five players because we're not paying them.

                        And if it is going on, then what it suggests is that we were paying them before and simply stopped.

                        But the thing is, evidence shows that it's not just the elite players who want money. A lot of players want money. It's a misconception that one-and-dones are the only guys out there hustling for perks. We know from LSU's and Louisville's situations that guys ranked a little lower were asking for a whole lot, and I imagine it's been that way for years.

                        So if UK was paying before, we're still paying. We're still getting elite players in terms of their reputations out of HS. I tend to think we're missing out on top five players for different reasons than that.

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                        • #42
                          Originally posted by Will Lavender View Post

                          I would too but I'm not sure this is what's going on with Kentucky, where we're missing out on these top five players because we're not paying them.

                          And if it is going on, then what it suggests is that we were paying them before and simply stopped.

                          But the thing is, evidence shows that it's not just the elite players who want money. A lot of players want money. It's a misconception that one-and-dones are the only guys out there hustling for perks. We know from LSU's and Louisville's situations that guys ranked a little lower were asking for a whole lot, and I imagine it's been that way for years.

                          So if UK was paying before, we're still paying. We're still getting elite players in terms of their reputations out of HS. I tend to think we're missing out on top five players for different reasons than that.
                          First, I hope we're not paying but who knows. I heard last night that Zion and the kid from New Albany that went to IU, were a part of the investigation. I am concerned about this continued investigation and wonder if UK's name will ever come up. I'm sure the NCAA, ESPN and Duke would love for it to.
                          John 3:3

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                          • #43
                            Originally posted by Will Lavender View Post

                            I would too but I'm not sure this is what's going on with Kentucky, where we're missing out on these top five players because we're not paying them.

                            And if it is going on, then what it suggests is that we were paying them before and simply stopped.

                            But the thing is, evidence shows that it's not just the elite players who want money. A lot of players want money. It's a misconception that one-and-dones are the only guys out there hustling for perks. We know from LSU's and Louisville's situations that guys ranked a little lower were asking for a whole lot, and I imagine it's been that way for years.

                            So if UK was paying before, we're still paying. We're still getting elite players in terms of their reputations out of HS. I tend to think we're missing out on top five players for different reasons than that.
                            It is a dirty business. If players did receive benefits, i think it came through celebrities and friends, not UK itself....
                            I can spell, blame it on my not so smart smart phone, makes up it's own words as it goes.....

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by J.Jennings View Post

                              It is a dirty business. If players did receive benefits, i think it came through celebrities and friends, not UK itself....
                              It is a filthy business for sure. But kind of a devils advocaete point of view is its dirty in large part due to the NCAA rules. For decades players/families have gone into programs because of impermissible benefits. It's therefore dirty.

                              But at the very base of it how evil is it for multi-billion dollar companies or rich boosters to give money to families who may be dirt poor? Sure the NCAA has a responsibility to have uniform rules to ensure an equal playing field for all member institutions. But they've clearly indicated that's not even their goal with their selective prosecution over the years. It seems they rarely ever do anything right when they gather in a board room.

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                              • #45
                                Originally posted by J.Jennings View Post

                                It is a dirty business. If players did receive benefits, i think it came through celebrities and friends, not UK itself....
                                It looks like the central hub of dirtiness is the grassroots organizations.

                                Apparently what's been happening over the last 10 or 15 years (maybe longer) is that the universities sent in their people to try and put in bids to the EYBL, adidas, and I imagine Under Armor. Highest bidder gets the player.

                                They've been using grassroots basketball as a kind of laundering service. I'll almost guarantee Kentucky has been part of that, and it likely didn't start with John Calipari. I also think, as Catsrock says, the way they've always handled this is to tell themselves the players deserve a lot of the cut, so the only way the cut can be given is under the table.

                                And they would be right about that. The question becomes how much stock do you put into amateurism, and do you believe these programs should be punished for exploiting grassroots basketball. That's the part I'm torn on, though I do believe that at this point if you want to punish anybody you're going to have to punish everybody--because they were all doing it.

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                                Class of 2020 - General Discussion

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