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Class of 2020 - General Discussion

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  • Will Lavender
    replied
    Looks like Kentucky is going to get Cade Cunningham to Big Blue Madness.

    UK hasn't had a great track record with BBM attendees since...well, in many years. But it's still a positive development. Cunningham would be one of the two or three best players to sign with UK in the Cal era--though I put the chances of that happening pretty close to 5%.

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  • Will Lavender
    replied
    A lot of buzz about Terrence Clarke being a hard Kentucky lean all of a sudden. He's in the class of 2021 but is rumored to be a reclassify to 2020.

    Would be the biggest UK commitment in years if it pans out.

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  • Dwight Schrute
    replied
    I think if everyone's cheating, no one is. I think if the NCAA tries to come down on this with any seriousness, you'll see the break away that John Calipari has predicted basically ever since he's been at Kentucky.

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  • Will Lavender
    replied
    Originally posted by J.Jennings View Post

    It is a dirty business. If players did receive benefits, i think it came through celebrities and friends, not UK itself....
    It looks like the central hub of dirtiness is the grassroots organizations.

    Apparently what's been happening over the last 10 or 15 years (maybe longer) is that the universities sent in their people to try and put in bids to the EYBL, adidas, and I imagine Under Armor. Highest bidder gets the player.

    They've been using grassroots basketball as a kind of laundering service. I'll almost guarantee Kentucky has been part of that, and it likely didn't start with John Calipari. I also think, as Catsrock says, the way they've always handled this is to tell themselves the players deserve a lot of the cut, so the only way the cut can be given is under the table.

    And they would be right about that. The question becomes how much stock do you put into amateurism, and do you believe these programs should be punished for exploiting grassroots basketball. That's the part I'm torn on, though I do believe that at this point if you want to punish anybody you're going to have to punish everybody--because they were all doing it.

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  • Catsrock
    replied
    Originally posted by J.Jennings View Post

    It is a dirty business. If players did receive benefits, i think it came through celebrities and friends, not UK itself....
    It is a filthy business for sure. But kind of a devils advocaete point of view is its dirty in large part due to the NCAA rules. For decades players/families have gone into programs because of impermissible benefits. It's therefore dirty.

    But at the very base of it how evil is it for multi-billion dollar companies or rich boosters to give money to families who may be dirt poor? Sure the NCAA has a responsibility to have uniform rules to ensure an equal playing field for all member institutions. But they've clearly indicated that's not even their goal with their selective prosecution over the years. It seems they rarely ever do anything right when they gather in a board room.

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  • J.Jennings
    replied
    Originally posted by Will Lavender View Post

    I would too but I'm not sure this is what's going on with Kentucky, where we're missing out on these top five players because we're not paying them.

    And if it is going on, then what it suggests is that we were paying them before and simply stopped.

    But the thing is, evidence shows that it's not just the elite players who want money. A lot of players want money. It's a misconception that one-and-dones are the only guys out there hustling for perks. We know from LSU's and Louisville's situations that guys ranked a little lower were asking for a whole lot, and I imagine it's been that way for years.

    So if UK was paying before, we're still paying. We're still getting elite players in terms of their reputations out of HS. I tend to think we're missing out on top five players for different reasons than that.
    It is a dirty business. If players did receive benefits, i think it came through celebrities and friends, not UK itself....

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  • Lighthouse
    replied
    Originally posted by Will Lavender View Post

    I would too but I'm not sure this is what's going on with Kentucky, where we're missing out on these top five players because we're not paying them.

    And if it is going on, then what it suggests is that we were paying them before and simply stopped.

    But the thing is, evidence shows that it's not just the elite players who want money. A lot of players want money. It's a misconception that one-and-dones are the only guys out there hustling for perks. We know from LSU's and Louisville's situations that guys ranked a little lower were asking for a whole lot, and I imagine it's been that way for years.

    So if UK was paying before, we're still paying. We're still getting elite players in terms of their reputations out of HS. I tend to think we're missing out on top five players for different reasons than that.
    First, I hope we're not paying but who knows. I heard last night that Zion and the kid from New Albany that went to IU, were a part of the investigation. I am concerned about this continued investigation and wonder if UK's name will ever come up. I'm sure the NCAA, ESPN and Duke would love for it to.

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  • Will Lavender
    replied
    Originally posted by Lighthouse View Post
    I would much rather have a clean program with our success, than have the so called "elite" players with the possibility of them or those around them being dirty, and win a tainted NC.
    I would too but I'm not sure this is what's going on with Kentucky, where we're missing out on these top five players because we're not paying them.

    And if it is going on, then what it suggests is that we were paying them before and simply stopped.

    But the thing is, evidence shows that it's not just the elite players who want money. A lot of players want money. It's a misconception that one-and-dones are the only guys out there hustling for perks. We know from LSU's and Louisville's situations that guys ranked a little lower were asking for a whole lot, and I imagine it's been that way for years.

    So if UK was paying before, we're still paying. We're still getting elite players in terms of their reputations out of HS. I tend to think we're missing out on top five players for different reasons than that.

    Leave a comment:


  • GOCAT15
    replied
    Originally posted by Lighthouse View Post
    I would much rather have a clean program with our success, than have the so called "elite" players with the possibility of them or those around them being dirty, and win a tainted NC.
    100% agree.

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  • J.Jennings
    replied
    Originally posted by Lighthouse View Post
    I would much rather have a clean program with our success, than have the so called "elite" players with the possibility of them or those around them being dirty, and win a tainted NC.
    Same here...

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  • Lighthouse
    replied
    I would much rather have a clean program with our success, than have the so called "elite" players with the possibility of them or those around them being dirty, and win a tainted NC.

    Leave a comment:


  • J.Jennings
    replied
    Basketball is business and the top players want to be the number one focus as well as compensated in my opinion, why do you think some just go overseas for a year and skip college all together? Not saying that all players are getting paid but maybe Cal has stayed away from the players and the camps around them that want benefits?Jay Z Drake even Lebron James and team Nike isn't hanging around the Kentucky program or Cal now a days. No doubt in my mind that other schools have found a loophole to compensate a player like Wiseman, Zion, and many others in my opinion. On the outside it may seem like Cal is losing but he's running a clean program probation free, we are doing okay imo...
    Last edited by J.Jennings; 08-15-2019, 09:52 AM.

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  • GOCAT15
    replied
    I will always say I don't want a kid that isn't willing to battle to earn a spot. If you don't have that mentality that you are going to work hard and are just going somewhere because you know you are easily one of the five best players on the team and will get PT then go for it. It's been proven year in and year out that minutes aren't what get you drafted. If you can't showcase your skills in 25-25 min, an extra ten isn't going to help.

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  • GOCAT15
    replied
    Originally posted by Will Lavender View Post
    Nick Richards got in the way this year, I would imagine.

    It's ironic that we want to keep players but if Richards were to have left, I would say we have no problem getting one (or both) of Blackshear or Dante. (Not sure about Wiseman; that was a tough deal because of Penny.)
    It's an impossible situation for a program because if they were to "Push" Nick out, whether it was a transfer or whatever and then still struck out with Blackshear and/or Dante then you are in even more peril. We all complain about kids not staying and then we wonder who we wouldve got if he wouldve left. Sure, I would trade Blackshear for Nick right now, just because Blackshear has proven himself, but Dante could be great and he may not.

    Penny really screwed us up and if he does well with this group you might as well throw him in the same conversation as Coach K and Self for future recruiting battles. Cal was the young swagger coach still when we got him, and now that is Penny. Time will tell how much he can coach, but we need him to not succeed or the recruiting is not going to get any easier in the future.

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  • J.Jennings
    replied
    Originally posted by Will Lavender View Post
    Nick Richards got in the way this year, I would imagine.

    It's ironic that we want to keep players but if Richards were to have left, I would say we have no problem getting one (or both) of Blackshear or Dante. (Not sure about Wiseman; that was a tough deal because of Penny.)
    I really don't know the answer or solution to this problem. How comfortable would a player feel about stepping into a program and taking away minutes from a guy who's worked hard and been there a few years? Everybody knows it business at the end of the day but if you are always going to recruit over someone else, then it makes sense why a player would rather go elsewhere and get 30 minutes to benefit himself over the team as opposed to playing for a school and having to scrap for 15 to 20 if you are lucky.................

    Leave a comment:

 

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Class of 2020 - General Discussion

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